
ifitbeyourwill Podcast
“ifitbeyourwill" Podcasts is on a mission to talk to amazing indie artists from around the world! Join us for cozy, conversational episodes where you'll hear from talented and charismatic singer-songwriters, bands from all walks of life talk about their musical process & journey. Let's celebrate being music lovers!
Season 6 starts Fall 2025… Looking for indie musicians
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ifitbeyourwill Podcast
ifitbeyourwill S06E08 • The Noisy
A candle lit in a tiny kitchen. A book of poems opened before the phone wakes the world. That’s where this story begins—at the border of dream and day—where Sara Mae Henke (The Noisy) learned to trust the spark that eventually leapt from the page to a microphone. We dig into how a poet’s routine became a musician’s backbone, and how community—slam circles, UT Knoxville’s scene, and a tight-knit queer network in the South—turned a good voice into a living catalogue of songs.
We talk about building an album like a neighbourhood: each track its own house with different colours, but all on the same street. Chappell Roan’s world-per-song approach hovers in the blueprint, while touchpoints span Mannequin Pussy’s snarl, Lucy Dacus’s glow, shoegaze haze, and the country DNA of a Maryland childhood soundtracked by Shania Twain and Carrie Underwood. The deluxe release, The Secret Ingredient Is Even More Meat, isn’t a victory lap—it’s a field report. Nightshade finally arrives from the original writing burst. Tony Soprano grows from an inward whisper to a communal hymn for grief. Morricone exists twice, riding from spaghetti-western swagger to true indie rock. Live tracks capture the Philly lineup breathing new life into the set.
Then we go stranger and truer: clown as a craft lens. Not costume, but consent—to be fully seen, to be in on the joke with the audience, to carry the thought you’d normally take back and turn it into a chorus. We unpack how embarrassment can become voltage, how idiosyncratic structures and non-traditional recording make room for surprise, and why intimacy with listeners beats suspicion. Along the way, we honour the collaborators who opened doors, lent gear, taught etiquette, and showed that independent musicians are some of the most generous people on earth.
If you’re curious about how poetry informs melody, how queer community shapes art, and how a deluxe record can map the life of songs onstage and off, you’ll feel at home here. Join us, subscribe to the show, and tell a friend who needs a spark. And if the music moved you, leave a review—what track hit first, and why?
Here we are, people. FB Your Will podcast, season six. Can you believe it? Six. What started out as a crazy idea has now evolved into 150 episodes. It's nuts.
Sara Mae:Congratulations.
colleyc:Thank you, Sarah. And I'm gonna bring uh my guests right in. I have Sara Mae Henke Heke, From The Noisy. And they're such a great band. I mean starting off, new record, the Lux coming out in October. And check the name of this guy. So I'm gonna say it because I love it. The secret ingredient is even more meat. Coming October 24th, 2022, 2023. Sarah, this is a pleasure having you on here. I've so enjoyed the version that was put out last year. Let me get the date right, which came out in May of 2024, where the even is not there. So it was just the secret ingredient is more. And Sarah, I've really enjoyed this deep dive on you because you are a quite a fascinating uh individual.
Sara Mae:Thank you. I appreciate that.
colleyc:Has lots of creativity and inspiration, I think, that you can inspire a lot of us and share in that creativity. I'd like to start these off with a little look back in time. I know that you're a poet. I know that poetry was always very important in your life as you grew up. How did that evolve into you eventually seeking out a master's in creative writing as a poet? Like how how did that journey happen for you?
Sara Mae:Absolutely. Also, it's so great to be here. So good to talk with you.
colleyc:Yeah, I'm looking forward to it.
Sara Mae:So I me too, me too. So let's see. I started doing poetry in undergrad. And when I was growing up, I wanted to be, you know, the next great American novelist. And then I got to college and I started to understand that poetry could be like a completely different thing from, you know, if you're not someone who's really interested in poetry, you might think it's like the Shakespeare's, it's the Emily Dickinsons. And of course, they're wonderful, but I didn't know it could be so present and so related to our lives right now. And so I think like the urgency of that really appealed to me. So I came up in these slam poetry circles in undergrad. I got really invested in the poetry scene, in community organizing around poetry. And I, you know, I had to move a bunch of times. So I finished undergrad. I was in Western Mass. I was in Minneapolis, and I came back to Baltimore, and then the pandemic hit. And it was during that time that I kind of came back to poetry and like my writing practice. And it felt like grad school was sort of this like North Star. And maybe even more than like grad school, it was just, you know, I really wanted a community of writers again, having moved so much. And it was just like it was getting up every day and writing is like the closest thing I have to a spiritual practice. And it was the thing I had that was like hopeful in that period of my life. Like writing something new felt generative in a time that like nothing really felt new. It felt pretty like flat and and isolated. So it was like my routine that I did for a while. And then I got into grad school like just after the vaccine started rolling out. And so it was like this exciting period of time. And yeah, I mean, Tennessee is where I went to grad school. I went to UT Knoxville, and it's sort of where I fell into the music scene. And I was really welcomed in. And before I had a chance to decide if I believed in myself, a bunch of amazing people like encouraged me to do music in a serious way. So that's that's where we are now.
colleyc:That's pretty cool.
Sara Mae:Yeah.
colleyc:Lots of traveling, so like that's an exhausting process, just that in and itself. Um so uh is it fair to say that the poetry informed your music? Like that's where uh the creativity uh seed started in in this in this writing, in this routine kind of ritualistic writing of I'm very curious about that. Like what what's your routine when you write? Like if if it's just poetry speaking, like you get up, you what do you absolutely.
Sara Mae:So for poetry, I feel like I'm only now finding my writing routine with with songwriting, but for poetry, I'll get up before my partner. I'll sit at when I was in Knoxville, I had this tiny, tiny, tiny kitchen, and we had what we called like our easy bake up, and it was just so small. But I would sit at the tiny kitchen counter and I would look out the window and I would light a candle, I would read a bunch of poetry, maybe it's a new book I'd picked up, or maybe I'd look at some like literary journals I really liked, and I would just sort of like get into that mode of thinking. And I like ideally like have not looked at my phone yet, you know. It's like before the world can get to me, and I'm still kind of coming out of my like dream state. Yeah, I like that's when I want to get to the page.
unknown:Yeah.
colleyc:Dreams like help to inform some of the things that end up on paper.
Sara Mae:I think so. Like sometimes if I dream about a certain thing, I'll try and investigate that on the page. I'm not so like, I feel like there are some really amazing writers who I love. Like Jess Rizcala is like this incredible poet. She's the reason I write poetry. Like, she was one of the first people who was like, you should write a slam poem. But she writes a lot about dreams. And I feel like her the way she translates her dreams into poetry is it's not so like, I don't know, like didactic. Like it's not just like one-to-one. Like, I feel like she is able to write about dreams and bring like the poetic voice into it in this really exciting way. But yeah.
colleyc:Yeah. And then where does this intersection between music? Like, when did music walk in the door with with you doing, you know, the poetry and the slams and like in walks music.
Sara Mae:In walks music. I mean, so I've been singing forever. I used to sing with my sister a lot and with my mom in the car. And, you know, first time I got a solo, it was a four-line solo in a play about Earth Day in fourth grade, and it was this big deal. And I, you know, in high school, I did some, like we had like a jukebox show is like kind of my shorthand for it. It was just like 20 songs or 40 songs that are 20 years old or older. And so I did that through high school. But I I just like didn't have and I I mean I played ukulele and guitar in high school, but I just like didn't have any confidence about it, slash like maybe like I should, maybe I should say I didn't have any ambitions about it.
unknown:Right.
Sara Mae:Like it was, I loved singing, and I knew that singing is like something that was special about me, but like I maybe just didn't know what to do with it yet. So I started really writing songs. When I was in undergrad, I was taking guitar lessons with my friend Jonathan. And I feel like we started, I like got so bored with the theory, and I feel like we just ended up being like, this is more time where we write songs together. So we were doing that a little bit. And then my friend Danny from Boston, like we met when we were both in school at Emerson College. He was just so encouraging of me, and he was like, You just have this really great voice. Like, I really think you should try and write some songs. You're a writer, like, we can do this. He like, only in hindsight did I really appreciate, like, he produced and recorded the second EP, which is called Day Night Dress, or is it called no, it's charm bracelet. Charm bracelet, that's so funny. It's that's the one, and he just did so much for me in that process. And that came out by the time I had moved to Knoxville. And it was around that time that my friend Josh in grad school was like, You have a great voice, we should play music together. And so it really is like like people sought me out and encouraged me in a way that like I'm really lucky for because I think if if no one had told me that this was meaningful, I might not have had the wherewithal to do it. So sorry, to answer your craft question, I think that I was writing songs. Poetry, I think I got so up in my head about during grad school. And I think like this record especially, I was writing it when I needed to get away from poetry, when I needed to like get out of the loops in my brain because I didn't know enough yet. And so it was all really intuitive. And I mean, I feel like I go back and I look at the songs, and there's like a lot of similar structures from song to song, and you know, I pick two chords and I play them back and forth, and then like that's the song, which is absolutely it works out great. Like you can yeah, you can have this like so many talented musicians around you who add to that, and we can make like interesting production choices together that like make the songs more and more special. And I think, yeah, now I feel like I'm working on the second record, and I I'm starting to learn a little bit more about theory, and I've taken a couple years of piano, and I just feel like I have this really, I feel a lot more like empowered in songwriting. I have this like really strong foundation, I think. I'm it's starting to crystallize and and sort of this like central concept, which I'm sure we can talk about, but that's been really nice. And I think now when I sit down to write a song, it's like just give me like a few hours and I'll just play things over and over and over again and and sing as I go and like kind of see what comes up for me.
colleyc:Right, right. And I think too, like I like what you're saying about like where the poetry would get too much, and like music is that kind of that release. Yes. And I feel that in the record. I feel like it's it's light and twangy at times, and yeah, poppy at others, and you know, it just has this great feel to it without being too dramatically like you know, shifting from like jazz to ambient. Sure, sure. It definitely plays around with styles and and different kinds of cultures as well. And I was reading too as I was preparing for this that integrating your music into your culture was something that was important to you, obviously. Can you kind of uh tell us about that that crossroad of when like from the queer community starting to like embrace more of the music that was coming from that community? And from what I read, you were a real you're a real troubadour in that area where you really want the awareness to be there, you know, and that it's not just an indie pot, you know, or it's not just alternative, it's our identity, and you're trying to like solidify that. How do you go about doing that so that awareness is out there and that you're also like I mean you're breaking walls down, I find, which is super brave. Where do you kind of find that crossroads and how do you how do you embrace your community and bring it into others?
Sara Mae:Thank you so much. That's so sweet. I think you know, I guess I think about community organizing a lot with this, like there were so many gay people around me in Tennessee, which was so like lucky for me because I think I was watching there's of course like a southern culture of like warmth and hospitality that is true and I think like informed the way like the music scene was there. But then there's also this like extra closeness of like gay people in the South banding together. And so I think that's partially why I don't know, I feel like there are maybe moments when I was younger where I was like, this isn't the most important thing about me. And I don't want to say it's like it is the most important thing about me now, but I think it's like it's worth celebrating, you know? And I mean, I like it was so crazy. I had this moment the other day, just as a quick side tangent, where I was playing Porch Fest on my partner's parents' porch, and there was a teenager, like a trans teen there who had, I guess, seen a show of mine last year, and they came up to me afterwards and they were like, Your music means so much to me. Like, this is so amazing. And I'm like, that's like beyond my wildest dreams. Like, that is like what I would really hope is like if this is touching even this single child in this way, like they were just saying, like, it's been such a hard year to be a trans person and like your music, I listen to your music when things are hard. So I'm like, I have wanted it to be this like life-affirming thing. And I just to kind of go back a little bit to your question, I think also like the record wouldn't sound the way it does without Chapel Roan. And like, I feel like she really like set up this. Every song has its own specific universe. And so, like, I think the record is cohesive in that it all has these kind of weird production choices. But like, yeah, each song is touching on a really different genre. Like, we were really thinking about Mannequin Pussy when we were figuring out production for twos. We were thinking about Lucy Dakis for Grenadine, we were thinking about, I mean, like, A Glass of Olives is a shoegase song. And then, you know, then I moved up to Philly and my friend was listening to my songs, and he was like, I can't wait for the noisy country record because you so clearly have like all this country influence. And I think that was living in Tennessee, but it was also like growing up, I grew up in Maryland, and my my parents listened to country music all the time and danced to it. And I feel like that's like also like Shania Twain and Carrie Underwood are like who I listened to growing up. So I don't know. I think that there is this sort of it feels like each song is maybe this is dramatic, but it does feel like each song is doing drag a little bit. Each song is sort of trying on these different like affects and and and yeah, really specific visual worlds. Like I at this point, I've done music videos for so many of the songs.
colleyc:Some of them are out there too.
Sara Mae:Like Yeah. No, it's there's a there's a big range.
colleyc:Yeah, totally. But you get that sense of I don't want to say over the top, but I want to say like you'll never see a video like this, you know, like it's so original and so unique. Thank you. And it it kind of brings me to like when you're when you're looking to put a put a bunch of songs together, how do you like what's that collaborative process? Because I mean, I'm looking on just your band camp where I can see uh all these amazing people that are that support. And I guess it comes back to that community that other people see this and want to be involved in it. Even though we kind of live in a time where it seems like it's under attack all the time. Yeah, there it's that's not reality. Reality is people are welcoming and and uh community is important to all people, regardless. How do you how do you welcome those people in that helped you with this record? Like, how did that community come to be that helped create this great record that and the deluxe it's coming out in October?
Sara Mae:Yeah, I'm so glad you asked that question. I feel like I was just looking at the credits because my my partner's a graphic designer, so he was like making all the cassette tape designs. And the credits list is so long, it's just like I'm so lucky that there's so many people that believed enough in this project to be a part of it. But so, so for the main, like the original record, my guitarist and dear friend Josh Sorrell, who is like helped write so many of these songs, he was friends with uh Jacob Lauder of Slow and Steady, which I think that project is, I think he he is like finishing up that project and he's gonna maybe start a new era, which is very exciting. But they knew each other from previous like music scene stuff in Greenville, South Carolina. And I just was really lucky that I feel like they kind of taught me how to be a musician. Like I really didn't know what I was doing. And that's like that's no shade to me. That's just like the reality of like I hadn't really been a part of a scene like that before. And I feel like I learned from them a lot of the like etiquette of just like musicians are like independent musicians are the most generous people in the entire world. And like, you know, there was like this a really steep learning curve for me. And also, like, I met Jacob, I think once before we stayed in his house for a week and a half and like recorded this record, which is insane. And like, and then the guitarist that we were gonna have go on tour with us dropped out after we finished recording. And like he had like an injury. It was like it was so it was such a bummer. But Jacob stepped up the day before we left for like a week-long tour and was down to do it. And and I should say too, like, my really good friend Ash Baker was a big part of the recording process. Like he did so much on that record, and he also was someone who was really encouraging and and gave me confidence during that process. And I don't even know. It's just like I feel like they were family in the truest sense. Like there were some really hard moments. I had a lot of self-doubt during that entire process, especially not knowing a lot of the technical things. Like, I think I left that process understanding that I wanted to double down on like learning about music theory and just learning how to be. I always say, like, I want to be better friends with my instruments. Like, I wanted to get better at guitar, I wanted to get better at piano. I still really want to learn fiddle, but we'll see.
colleyc:Interesting instrument. It's fun.
Sara Mae:It's really cool. And I mean, like, there's nothing like being at a bar in Knoxville, and there's this one person, Evie, who will like show up at at like music night, and inevitably she'll know like the person performing and she'll hop up on stage and just like by ear, just start playing. She's incredible.
colleyc:I envy those people that it's so cool. You know, they hear a song and they'll just start playing right along to it at the same time. Wait a minute.
Sara Mae:No, it's amazing.
colleyc:Where are the chords? Where are the they just uh it's so cool. Um I think that what you're saying though about this with commun like you build a community around your music to help support your music and to learn more about your music. And now you're able to take that community and share it with the greater community.
Sara Mae:Yeah.
colleyc:I find that that is just like it's a very powerful basically. I I guess my thesis is bands are communities, right? And yeah, and when the band doesn't exist anymore, then there's no community anymore, right? It's not like it transfers over to something else. And when you when you kind of like think about the next, you know, the next step. So you have this deluxe coming out.
Sara Mae:Yes.
colleyc:What what Sarah's the next? Like where like you have this amazing, it sounds like a really tight community that's supporting you and encouraging. And is that daunting in a way? Or are you like, I love this? Now we're gonna get going. Like you thought that first LP was something weight. Like, where are you at? So it's only what you can. I don't want to reveal any secrets that you have to oh, I appreciate it, you know, just release-wise and stuff like that. But I'd love to where does this go?
Sara Mae:Yeah, I mean, I think even a month ago, I might have said it was really daunting. I think like I have worked really hard in the last month through shows I played, through classes I've been taking, and just like my general routine around songwriting. I I'm able to better see all of the blessings in my life. Like, I think that there have been a lot of moments, especially in the move to Philly and like losing that that music community in Tennessee and in Greenville. Like, I yeah, I've had a lot of self-doubt. And I think that the new record is gonna be called Goodnight Hot Clown. And I have been taking clown classes while here in Philly. There's a funny thing about Philly is that we have shockingly a vibrant clown scene. So I've been taking all these clown classes, and I have spent the year like kind of meditating on embarrassment and its role in my life. And I feel like this year I've really strengthened a lot of my friendships with musicians here in Philly. And I've been really lucky, like I've had to sub people in and out for different shows based on like availability, and and I've also I've started to sort of figure out like who my main collaborators are, and my really good friend Daniel Sohn and Nate Kim, I think are gonna kind of be with me for like writing this next record. But you know, we've been talking a lot about like what does clown look like in music, and not just in the like you go on stage and you powder your face kind of way, but like what is it, what would it mean to bring like a clown sensibility to songwriting?
colleyc:I mean, I guess defining what clown is, right? Like, what is that to us, right?
Sara Mae:Like absolutely, and and I I think it's like just this like bursting feeling. Like it's like this part of you that you're not censoring, that you know, the I've been told like the clown elders say that clown is who you would be if like you were never told like that's wrong, that's embarrassing, that's bad. And so I think like giving myself moments to like feel the full scope of feeling in a song. I think there have been moments in the past where in my writing, what I'm trying to do is sort of polish a feeling and like bring it to the reader or to the listener in a way that is digestible. And I feel like Hot Clown, it's like I'm writing less one-to-one, like confessional story, but I think I'm bringing a certain bursting feeling, and I'm like putting it into this like framework of clown. So I think like it's been really fun to write lyrics for this. And it's been really fun to try out different things in music. And I think like having like idiosyncratic songwriting is like I'm I'm just feeling so excited about the possibilities. And I think working with Daniel, especially, who has like Daniel and Nate just have their music brains are absurd and off the charts, and I think getting to really try a lot of like non-traditional approaches to recording, I think is gonna be really fun. So I think like letting myself be in a place of wonder about writing again, I think is gonna be really great.
colleyc:And I like too that idea of a different perspective, too. Like, are you saying like looking through the lens of what we're defining a clown to be? Like, are you approaching the songs in that way? Like that like they're playful, comical, light, uh surprising. Like you want that aesthetic of to embed itself with the song.
Sara Mae:Totally. Like, I think maybe a helpful way of thinking about it is you know how improv people are yes and.
colleyc:Yeah.
Sara Mae:I think clown is like it's like the thought that you say out loud that you're like, oh, I wish I could take that back. It's like kind of I don't want to say it's like first thought, best thought exactly. Like that's not how I'm writing the lyrics, but I think it is sort of that it's like that what's going through your head when you're trying to stop yourself from crying, where you're like, the like when you feel like the weight behind your eyes and you're like, oh my gosh, oh my gosh, oh my gosh. It's like, how am I able to talk about the things in my life that make me feel that way? And how am I able to be honest in that? And I think also one thing I love about Clown is that it's about being in on the joke with the audience. And I feel like so much of my writing in the past has been I'm suspicious of my audience. I, you know, all this stuff about like the male gaze and and like being like, I feel like I don't know, Mitski is someone who talks a lot about like being a product for the audience. Like I hate what she says, like, I hate when people like take videos of me while I'm performing, whatever. But I think clown is this more like generous and like almost like an intimacy with an audience where you're you're in it together. And so it's like, how do I invite the audience in in this like generous and trusting way, and also allow myself to be honest in that place and not try and polish and manufacture and and whatever else?
colleyc:I love it. I can't wait. Thank you. That'd be so cool. So the the deluxe comes out, the secret ingredient is even more meat coming out this month. Yep. What what is the difference between like what's the deluxe? Can you kind of like where does the deluxe fit in in this record?
Sara Mae:Yeah, absolutely. There's so much about it that I'm really excited about. So the new track Nightshade just dropped, and it was like, I think in the same burst of songwriting that the rest of the record was written in. It just like like just missed the window for recording. So I'm really glad it ended up making it on the record. We reimagined Tony Soprano. The original is super intimate and internal. And this one is a lot, it's a lot bigger, and it feels a lot more like a communal experience of grief. And the new neckline is this like it to me, it's like me reaching towards Chapel Roan because the original neckline was really intimate. And there was a performance I did with my friend Josh where he played, they had there was like a standing piano at the venue, and it was like just me and him. And I feel like that's kind of how we based the production for that song. But this neckline is like, yeah, poppy and exciting, and it's sort of my like pink pony club, like same chords the entire song. So, and then we've got these like live tracks, and and I think that was really cool because that's the live band I've been playing with in Philly. So I think it's also showing like the life of this record all the way through. And so that it then it also includes the very first single before the record even came out, like the original version of Morricone, which was like yeah, more like country spaghetti western. And I think like the newer version of Moricone that came out on the full-length record is like a true indie rock song that was like kind of the brainchild of of the producer Jacob. It's really cool.
colleyc:Yeah. Great record. I haven't heard the the Lux tracks, but I've been listening to like I mentioned before. Just such a great, great record.
Sara Mae:Thank you so much.
colleyc:What happens with this into 2026? So it drops. Do you head out on the road at all, or do you have a launch show, or is there anything you can tell uh the listeners as to what's coming down?
Sara Mae:Yeah, we're gonna do a bunch of shows in November. So I think we're gonna do a special release show at Lingerette. We really wanted to do something at a record store so that it makes the cassettes feel kind of special. So that'll be at Lingerette, which is just a Loved records right here in Port Richmond on November 9th. I think we're also gonna be playing Philamoca on November 5th for the Philadelphia Tenants Union. So it's gonna be kind of two different like flavors of the songs because one's gonna be a much more intimate show. I think a bunch of friends are gonna come and sing Tony with us. And then after that, there is a there's a tour I'm planning with a couple of friends that might be deeper into the winter. We're gonna all, it's three of us, and we're gonna play in each other's projects and go on the road as like three bands. So I think that'll be probably touring through the south.
colleyc:So yeah. So there's a lot coming from the noisy down the road. Lots of more collaboration. A new interesting record is slowly coming into the lots of exciting things coming down the road. I'm excited for you.
Sara Mae:Thank you. It feels like an exciting time.
colleyc:Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely. I'm really happy you put this record out. I'm even happier there's a deluxe. This has been so fun talking with you. I really appreciate it.
Sara Mae:Thank you so much for having me. I really appreciate it.
colleyc:Yeah, it's been such a I mean you're you're very insightful and I love your words. Like you take time to think about what you want to say.
Sara Mae:Thank you, thank you.
colleyc:The record dropping. Check it out, check it out. If you see the noisy show, go and watch it and buy it. The t-shirt or cassette support.
Sara Mae:Thank you, Chris. It's been so fun.
colleyc:Like a folded atlas, you said you were looking at the audience. Back to be colour road maps, car windows opening. It touched your shoulder, and you reached back for me. Was the air between us hungry? Or was it only me? You tell me not to cheat your hand on my knee you tell me not to check your hand on my knee that I used there's certain kinds of restraint Space Bravity Sparnit got carried away in my blue dress. You started practicing distance between my legs, we bend now is practicing quiet my hips to the highway. In calling it space, restraint, remember the pulsing moon over the rough pumples. How you went up ahead? Where the dead fields were quiet. We were meadow walking, the trees were reaching out, the grass was sleep breathing, everything felt like crying.