ifitbeyourwill S05E02 • The Golden Dregs

Chapters

• 17:45 Season 5 Welcome
• 20:23 Emotional Reflections on Music
• 29:33 Introducing Ben Woods of The Golden Dregs
• 1:49:14 The Progression of Songwriting
• 6:15:20 Collaborating for the New Album
• 19:33:43 Future Plans and Farewell

Transcript

Chris: 0:17

Season 5, welcome. I've been getting it wrong Started crying.

Ben Woods: 0:24

Season five Welcome. This is our second episode of season five. Actually, I have Ben Woods coming in from the UK, who is the Golden Dregs Great new record coming out One single already out, and we're going to feature another single at the end of this podcast. So stay tuned to listen to what the golden dregs sound like, but first we'll get to know them a little bit, or him, uh, ben, hey, hi, how's it doing? Thanks for having me. I'm very well. Thank you, yeah, I've been a long time follower, um, so when I saw that you had some new stuff, I was like, okay, gotta reach out, gotta see. And so I was super happy that you took me up on this invite.

Ben Woods: 1:05

I mean, yes man so then you've been doing this for a while, right? Um, I was just looking at your pros perusing your your band camp page, um, and I mean you've got the earliest release on there. You've got some early, really 2017. Okay, role of a life. Well, I guess that was a single right, but, uh, single um, you're pretty prolific.

Ben Woods: 1:31

A couple of eps before that, which I've since removed, okay, um, and some of the tracks got repurposed on other records, but, um, so, yeah, it's probably about you know, coming up to 10 years of releasing recorded material, amazing, amazing and it's such a distinct style like.

Chris: 1:48

I love your voice and the comparisons that it gets to. You know cohen and callahan and um, that baritone, and but you're not only the, the voice that you found within the golden dregs, but the songwriting is really strong, um your storytelling is just um. I love it. I love your stories that you tell through your song how did it begin for you then? Like like, if you could bring us back in time a little bit, what are some of those early recollections of, of music being important to you?

Ben Woods: 2:20

uh, I mean my, my writing probably dates back to, you know, around that time we talk about the early recordings I was living in Falmouth, which is a town in Cornwall, which is a very southern point in the UK, south of where you can go, and there's a really good sort of garage punk rock sort of scene going on there and I was recording a lot with people and I loved the music and I was playing drums a lot of the time. But I think I felt like I wanted to address this kind of more like lyric focused music that I was maybe interested in or that had resonated with me growing up, music that I was maybe interested in or that had resonated with me growing up. Um, so the first recordings and the first album that I put out kind of utilizes the musicians on the scene on that scene and I actually I looked through um, looked through your podcast and saw you've done an interview with Holiday Ghosts. Yes, um, so we came up at the same time. Okay, I played in holiday ghosts for a little bit back in the days, but, um, that's cool, it means to run a studio together and, yeah, kind of came from a similar place and the holiday ghost, I think is birthed of a similar thing.

Ben Woods: 3:35

It's, you know, everything was quite uh, it was kind of high octane, intense, like yeah, garage punk sort of music. Holiday ghost was kind of like. Maybe in its early days was a sort of more reserved alternative for sam to sam and cat to explore their songwriting for sure.

Chris: 3:54

No, they have a great story too. That's, that's a great connection to, to have.

Ben Woods: 3:57

Yeah, yeah, you know we're still, you know still uh, still hanging out and they're back and forth, but we spent the year together and, yeah, amazing, amazing and like do you remember those earlier recordings like what, where you started to feel inspired to write and to to sing, like becoming a singer songwriter?

Chris: 4:16

could you walk us through a bit of that process, of how you came to?

Ben Woods: 4:18

things I was inspired by, yeah, particular.

Ben Woods: 4:21

Well, I came at writing from a recording perspective, I was studying, recording and we had this tape studio and, um, yeah, friends would recommend stuff to me, I guess, and I kind of was put onto the likes of smog and silver jews I'd maybe, I'd probably overlooked until my over 20, my early 20s, you know, yeah, when I was younger I always loved, you know, like Joni Mitchell and Neil Young and that's a world of like kind of classic songwriters, without dissecting it too much, but, um, yeah, that's sort of like like the beat happening, all these things that were kind of like a low-fi recording, aesthetic, yeah, um, and magnetic fields, and I think they kind of made me feel like um, because I wasn't particularly competent, I wasn't confident in my voice and I wasn't a competent player of my instruments beyond the drums. You know, I was great drums, but listen to those recordings.

Ben Woods: 5:25

It kind of made me feel like it didn't really matter so much, like the vibe a new perspective on yeah, totally, totally, that kind of got me started and, um, I think you can hear in the first, the first album, lafayette.

Chris: 5:40

I'm really like figuring it out yeah, totally, I hear you hit on that like I love the progression two of your records because it does feel like you're learning from one to the next, to the next. Definitely, almost you know you feel the growth happening.

Ben Woods: 5:54

Um, it's funny actually looking back because, um, I think you look at even up until the last record, it's like these three records are all quite different. There's maybe like a through line, but they're different, and it maybe seems like, oh, maybe I don't know what I'm doing, so I'm trying to play with it. But by the fourth album it's like okay, this is like what the thing is right now. It's like enough different directions in it. I feel like it makes more sense.

Chris: 6:19

You know, I totally agree, like the first single off of godspeed which is coming out in April. People, april 27th 25th. Excellent studio and the single that's that that you've released already, the company of strangers. I mean it does feel like you've. It's a coming of age, almost like your sound is there, finally, or it like right.

Chris: 6:42

It's all solidifying, all the crystallization is happening. I think every record is a stepping stone in a way, because it allows you to find so. It was interesting what you said. So the three records that are the your latest ones, are all very different, right, I mean, I, I hear that, but you said there's a thorough line. How would you connect all those three together? What do you think it is about it other than being you?

Ben Woods: 7:13

I think maybe the like lyrical intent of them, perhaps whether it always lands the way I would have intended it to, more so than my voice, because that is something I have been figuring out and that definitely changes through the records as I become more comfortable with it. But I think the songwriting voice is kind of um, consistent throughout there you.

Chris: 7:44

I love your voice. I wanted to ask you about that too. How did you come to find it? Because?

Chris: 7:49

it is so distinct.

Chris: 7:52

I talked to somebody just the other day Nico, he's in this band, Friko Cool, yeah, he said it took him about five years to find his voice.

Ben Woods: 8:02

I never thought that it would take that long, but I guess in retrospect, like it does take time to figure out where your highs and your lows, and if you could push this extra one a little bit further without it snapping the back of the song, or yeah, I mean, I, I like, when I was first, you know, in this sort of scene of bands playing in my early 20s, late teens I was, you know, music we listened to was like Black Lips and Strange Boys and White Fence, and I was trying to, I tried to emulate that style of singing higher, and there's a bit of that in the first album maybe, but it was like a strain for me really. But it was like a strain for me really. Um, and I kind of quickly realized that the songs where I kind of delivered a more intimate performance were the ones that resonated more. And it wasn't in the second album there's still not throughout the whole of the record, but there's certainly some tracks on there where I was like, okay, I think I've got it now.

Ben Woods: 9:01

Um, yeah, I figured out, was there a song in particular, been where. We're kind of like you're like okay that this is, yeah, getting close to what I envisioned way back when I started this it was uh, nobody ever got rich your father.

Ben Woods: 9:17

He was drunk and almost always right. He made sure that you grew up too fast at night. He speaks to God what I never got rich, hey son. You know I never got rich. I worked all my damn life and I never got rich. Hey God, why'd I never got rich? Hey god?

Ben Woods: 10:11

and that one, um, I'd had the, I'd had the verses for that song for a couple of years and was going to leave it as is, with a sort of instrumental chorus. And then I started singing the chorus in this more intimate way and I actually really distinctly remember it, kind of clicking me like, okay, this is maybe how I can best express my narratives, my feelings, whatever For sure.

Chris: 10:43

And how do you? What's your process about for writing songs Like how do you? How do you start from an idea to something?

Ben Woods: 10:51

Well, it's always it's been thrown out of whack. Really, like I was always proud of being like, oh yeah, I can, I like I like to write my lyrics first or I write them as I play guitar. You know, like it was like classic and right and like it comes from this like place deep, deep within. But since the I hate to mention it but since the lockdown, I was right during that period I was writing a lot of music but didn't have much lyrical inspiration. But then, you know, I was kind of had this I was kind of freed from having to work and so I was spending my days just making music and really enjoying that process, and then I had to kind of write to the music, right, and that's kind of gifted me the most part of the last album, this new album. I'm really pleased to say that I've kind of cleared that backlog of these musical ideas, because I kind of hate to waste an idea before I've seen it through. How do you?

Chris: 11:53

know when it is one that you'll take note of that one and shelve it. But I'm coming back to that because it had something. What are you looking for when you find the thing that that that makes that song, you know, individual or I've become more picky with each album.

Ben Woods: 12:12

You know, for the first, when I did hopeless of the hopeless, there were no extra tracks written for. That was just like the album lafayette. There was like I wrote a lot of songs and I kind of put them, put them out as eps or whatever stragglers and whatnot. Right, right, right. And then on grace and dignity, I there were a few extra cuts I kind of took off the record and and then, for this, got for godspeed. I wrote a lot of stuff I didn't use. That I kind of have to. I just have to get more discipline with recognizing when an idea is not working and it doesn't need more energy putting into it. And the joy of having hard drives is I can just leave it and it's there because I still, you know, there's ideas I shelved during the writing process of this album. But the melodies are coming back to me in my day to day and I'm like, okay, well, maybe there's something in that. I just wasn't doing it, right, you know right, right.

Chris: 13:09

It's interesting, though, that that that these artifacts that you keep can always you know, that you have this mindset that, yeah, I might use that, you know, or take that little piece and insert it there, like it's definitely um a great way to journalize your, your journey, as well as as you're building I I read that this, the, the latest record coming out in april, godspeed is, was a different kind of collaboration, and tell me if I'm wrong here that most of the other songs and records that you'd put out was very much you and this one had more people involved in it, or like did you bring songs to a group of people saying I want your input, or did you have pretty much how you wanted to sound when you brought the songs to your collaborators?

Ben Woods: 13:55

I I wanted to approach this album. So we toured the last album a lot more than I ever toured an album. Um, because you know we had quite, we had a sort of air quotes, proper release for it on a label, and we toured events in the states and extensively around europe and festivals and stuff um, so we came out of it as a sort of like kind of, dare I say, a professional band.

Ben Woods: 14:18

You know, like we kind, of figured out how to play, because we we came to it as a group of friends really, um, and I think during the process we kind of figured out how to play it.

Ben Woods: 14:23

Cause we, we came to it as a group of friends really, um, and I think during the process we kind of figured out a sort of musical pathway for ourselves and, um, I, yeah, I wanted to approach this album focusing on the production and the song writing, but not necessarily focusing on getting the right takes myself, you know, okay, okay, and I wanted to kind of.

Ben Woods: 14:54

I think there's in any sort of collaboration there's give and take, and I feel like to allow the, my bandmates, my friends, to feel ownership over this thing. You know, it's nice for everyone to be kind of um invested creatively as well. You know, I don't want to feel like they're traipsing around europe playing, playing these parts. I've told them to play, you know, and this makes me sound like I'm a dictator, but I guess I am in a respect, but you know it's not comes from a um comes from a point of interest and compassion, I suppose, um, and yeah, you know, each, each member of a group sort of has their own, uh, musical background. They're all quite different and I kind of wanted to bring that into it separately. So I could it yeah, it wasn't, the songs were kind of done um, but I would book each of them in for a couple of days each in the studio to come and bring some ideas in and play, play their parts and I think the album's better for it yeah, yeah.

Chris: 16:00

What were some? Some of the surprises that you didn't expect with opening up the collaboration like that are there. Were there things that were unexpected in in the creation of the newest record?

Ben Woods: 16:11

um, there were no real curveballs, I don't think. I kind of I I didn't know what the outcome was going to be, but I kind of had an expectation of how involving the others was going to shape the record. For example, I played drums myself in the last two albums and matt, our drummer, has a very, uh, very different approach to the drums. I knew from the ground up that's the first thing we brought in, that's gonna really drastically change it, and I wanted to make a more. You know, discounting the first album. The last couple of records are very gentle and I wanted to create a more instantaneous set of songs. You know, yeah, um, and matt's the guy for that.

Chris: 16:58

So that's cool, that's cool and and I imagine just seeing his approach to what he would put down on tape as opposed to yours quite different. But you're able to I want you to, you know take care of that kind of like lighten your load a bit, because yeah, as well, like was this your production? Was this your production as well?

Ben Woods: 17:19

this the latest record as well yeah, I've only ever produced my records myself okay. Okay, the last two I've gone and mixed with someone else who's kind of gotten a bit involved. At that point I kind of went a bit, took a bit of a deep dive on it. This time I had a bit of help. I had a friend come into the studio with me for a couple of days Alistair and I kind of lost sight of getting the mixes across the line. He had a very great technical ear. He just came in and was like this isn't sitting quite right. Blah, blah, blah, and that was really good.

Chris: 18:03

It gives your ears, too, a little bit of a different perspective as well, because I imagine you get so inundated in these songs and the.

Ben Woods: 18:10

I completely every little thing, yeah yeah, yeah, I mean we, we got dropped from our record label two days before we went into the studio to make it. Um, so I and it was in their studio in the basement of their offices, but it still lets studio time, which is really great, um, but I was like, well, I've got five weeks to make an album. That's gonna, you know, prove ourselves, prove them wrong, that kind of thing. I went in seven days a week for five weeks across christmas, um, and I was just kind of a bit tunnel vision on it. I definitely thought it was finished long before it was finished and it took guidance from the guys in the band and our management to be like I feel like you need to do a bit more work on this and yeah, could you see that too?

Chris: 18:59

like was that like?

Ben Woods: 19:01

yeah, once I was told I think people were scared to tell me because it had been such an emotional few months. Well, we don't want to rock the boat here.

Chris: 19:09

You're like maxing it out.

Ben Woods: 19:12

I was like don't worry, guys, we'll get signed again. And the rejection emails start coming in and the crosses on the spreadsheet are filling up. I'm like, well, we're going to go now.

Chris: 19:27

It's tough business, that's for sure Tough business, so kind of bring things to a close here. Ben, thanks again for coming and sharing. I love your stories. Um, what, what? What does the rest of 2025 look like? So the record drops in april, and what are your plans with?

Ben Woods: 19:45

it we're doing, um, we're doing a few dates in support of it, a short release tour in May and, yeah, lining up some festivals for the summer. But to be honest, I don't know. I don't really know what is going to happen in that department. You know, we have a new agent working with us. I really like him. He has a really good idea of how to position the band and, you know, just have to see how it connects. There's so much, there's so much music out there and everyone's fighting for the livers of the same pie and totally you know people like it great.

Ben Woods: 20:26

You know, I set up my own label to release this record and it's in collaboration with end of the road, who are a great um music festival in the uk.

Ben Woods: 20:37

That's it yeah these music with them before and they manage our band, um, and so I really love the autonomy I have there over what I'm doing, and I'm using that platform to release some other records with some other artists that I work with in the studio. So, um, that's amazing. That's keeping me busy. It's a busy year. Whether it's going to all be on the road or not, I don't know Right.

Ben Woods: 21:02

Well, it's kind of that fun part of it too. Right, you never know what's gonna like. I suspect you're gonna get a really good reception with this record. Sure, I've only heard one of the singles, but like I said before. It has that crystallization of of the golden dregs coming together. So I'm really excited to hear the rest of it. But it does have that like authentic feel like and settled like right, something's solidified together. Um, my words are are losing me here now. That's pretty cool. Yeah, I know, I've really appreciated and I've listened to all your records too.

Ben Woods: 21:42

Right like I, I know what your sound started like and how it evolved, and so I was really excited with that, that single that came up. So I do encourage all the listeners to go and grab a show if you can get this record as well. And you know, I just wish you all the best, ben, I mean thank you, keep doing it.

Chris: 21:59

I imagine the songwriting continues on in your world yeah, yeah, I'm looking towards the next record at the moment. I started mapping out a few ideas and I've been writing with a few other people for different projects and just seeing I'm just seeing what happens now. You know Absolutely.

Ben Woods: 22:17

I've had a shift Best. Yeah, that's it. Well, I'm glad that your heart is still open to creating this music for us. I don't know what else I'd do. Yeah, exactly. Well, keep it up. I'll be watching you as you progress through and again thanks so much for taking some time nice one.

Ben Woods: 22:34

Thank you so much for having me cheers.

Ben Woods: 22:38

If you're so sure, then go tell it to the mountain. Like you've held the answers all along, Maybe it's time that I was taken out to pasture. Seems lately I've been getting it wrong. You started crying when the morning came too early. You said I promised you that things would always stay the same. Guess I never had something I believed in For long enough to make a change.

Ben Woods: 23:16

And if you told me how you were feeling, I could say, say, say something profound, like leaving is the best type of healing. Or if he were here, then he would be proud Of how you turned out. But don't let God speed the company. Take all you need. What were you saying about necessary evil? Did you ever feel your life was an angel? Cause he'd be loaded his to the company, the company of strangers. And that's why God speed the company. Break all you company. Break all you see. And in the west we were deafened by thunder and you held me till the fear ran out. I must admit that we're not all that different. Till you put the words inside my mouth, you put the words inside my mouth. You put the words inside my mouth, you put the words inside my mouth.

Ben Woods: 25:26

I've been working for the company of strangers. Been working for the company of strangers. Been working for the company of strangers. Been working for the company of strangers. Been working for the company of strangers? Yeah, I'm in the company of strangers. Yeah, I'm in the company of strangers. Yeah, I'm in the company of strangers. Yeah, I'm in the company of strangers now.