ifitbeyourwill Podcast
“ifitbeyourwill" Podcasts is on a mission to talk to amazing indie artists from around the world! Join us for cozy, conversational episodes where you'll hear from talented and charismatic singer-songwriters, bands from all walks of life talk about their musical journey. Let's celebrate being music lovers!
Season Four runs from September 2024 to December 2024
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ifitbeyourwill Podcast
ifitbeyourwill S04E26 • Lucas Mayo of Pickle Darling
Lucas Mayo, affectionately known as Pickle Darling, shares the musical journey that took him from strumming a ukulele in his primary school days to becoming a defining voice in the indie pop scene. We explore the powerful impact of DIY ethos, drawing inspiration from artists like Dylan of Bedbug, and how these influences have shaped his distinctive sound. Lucas offers a candid glimpse into his time at music school, where songwriting became his refuge, and discusses the collaborative spirit that fuels his projects.
Continuing our conversation, Lucas reveals the art of embracing limitations to craft authentic music from his home studio. We dissect the evolution between his albums, "Cosmonaut" and "Laundromat," highlighting a shift towards a spontaneous, raw style that captures the essence of daily inspiration. Lucas offers a peek into his latest project, where experimental recording techniques take center stage, showing his relentless dedication to evolving his sound. Our discussion also reflects on the synergy between songwriting and production, underscored by his experiences with the legendary band The Bats, which transitioned him from studio work to vibrant live performances.
Performing live, Lucas finds a unique connection with audiences, from intimate solo shows to energetic band settings. He shares his admiration for Billy Bragg, whose simple yet impactful performances inspire Lucas's own aspirations. With exciting future projects on the horizon, including an upcoming album and a video game soundtrack, Lucas promises to push the boundaries of his creativity while keeping accessibility at the forefront. As we conclude, we celebrate the vibrant community that surrounds the podcast, leaving listeners eager for the new chapters yet to unfold.
And if you think it feels like work, I'm willing to put the work in. Yes, I'm willing to put the work in, and if you need a reminder, I'm willing to remind you that. I'm willing to remind you that I'm willing to put the work in. I'm willing to put the work in, that I'm willing to put the work in. I'm willing to put the work in.
Speaker 2:Alright, here we go. Hey everyone, another episode of your Will podcast. I'm reaching far. I actually woke him up out of his bed, out of his beautiful slumber, because I was just so excited and it was my mistake. I'm sorry, lucas, because I was like 2 o'clock, 2 o'clock, can't wait. And then I realized it was 3 o'clock and like early your time, so I have pickle darling. Uh, lucas, here with us from from his, his moniker, his band, his music. Um, coming all the way in from christ church, new zealand. Um, lucas, you're the first new new zealandite Zealander.
Speaker 3:How do you say it? New, zealander, new? Zealander? Yeah, that makes sense.
Speaker 2:I thought that's New, zealander, that's good, yeah, that makes sense to me. So first time that we've reached into your country to discover some of the music and been a long-time listener I mean, pickle Darling makes these beautiful indie pop gems uh, very diy, uh, but great collaborators you work with. And you know my first question actually I discovered this by listening back to your that you have a relationship with bedbug, with dylan from bedbug yeah, cool how did that come to be? If you're well sort of.
Speaker 3:I don't know if I'd call it a relationship, I guess so I mean I'm a fan, yeah yeah, I'm, I was um.
Speaker 3:So I think when I first, when I was kind of first um, before I was releasing music, I was a big fan of, like I would just go through band camp and discover a lot of, like you know, lo-fi stuff, yeah, and a lot of the artists that I was like a big fan of also. You know, I eventually kind of became friends with them just through the internet, cause I was following the label Z tapes Well, it's actually meant to be pronounced as Z tapes, but it sounds wrong. Yeah, and Dead Bug was one of them and I was such a big fan of their first album and it was like it was kind of one of those albums that's like I mean, I love all their albums, particularly the second album. The second album's amazing.
Speaker 3:But yeah, I feel like it's cool when you hear something that is like it feels like oh okay, this is how I can participate in this as well. It kind of gives you permission to Just the way it's recorded, how it's so scrappy but also there's so much song craft in there and it's it's so scrappy but also there's so much song craft in there and it it's not like a. You couldn't hear lots of expensive gear or expensive studio um, but it has. But it's also just as amazing, sounding as like an animal collective album.
Speaker 2:You know, it's just yeah, for sure, I mean. I I feel um a lineage between you know, dylan, and and what you're doing as well. There's this commonality, or a tipping of the cap to one another in your song crafting.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I definitely see myself as still like they're kind of still one of those artists that I'm like um, I'm still kind of chasing what they do a little bit like yeah, but you've been doing this for a while now.
Speaker 2:I guess, like this is you. You had laundromat that came out in 2023, but you have other three, other four other full, full records. Really, I mean, yeah, um, under your belt. Um, maybe before we dive into the records, I'd love to kind of ask you about how, how you came into starting to song, right and um, you know where you picked up your first instrument and like how did it all kind of start clicking for you? Where, where music had to be a part of your daily functionings in this world of ours?
Speaker 3:I think it was, I guess in primary school. I was like it was kind of embarrassing. I was playing ukulele a lot in primary school when I was way too old to be like getting rid of the ukulele and I'd be playing like you know, learning like Smells Like Teen Spirit and like Steward of Heaven and Sweet Child Of Mine on the ukulele. I was like, yeah, I want to be like that. And then eventually I got into guitar and so I guess tried to play the same songs. But I think eventually I got to the point where I was like I just I don't know you kind of just get bored of just trying to learn songs or you just learn the parts of songs that you like and you're just more interested in writing your own songs. So there's not many songs that I can actually play right through. If I went on stage and people were like requesting like I don't know Wonderwall, I probably couldn't play it. I don't know what to think about. Couldn't play it.
Speaker 2:But I was like I could write songs and then like, yeah, I go, something like that, yeah yeah, um, totally, totally.
Speaker 3:But yeah, I think, and even when I was like studying music, because I went to um music school it's called the jazz school, but I didn't study jazz, um, and three years of that and it was like I felt so out of place, I mean I still I I have fond experiences there because, like, to be honest, the tutors were all pretty great and all the people were great, um, but I was just like, oh, I'm clearly like maybe kind of the wrong person, like I just, I don't know, I'm just so like shit at my instrument and I was also never that interested in like getting good at my instrument. I just wanted to write songs and just like make my own, like lo-fi shit.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, um was it a? Was it a songwriting course that? I think I read that air I I heard um, maybe on another podcast.
Speaker 3:I said so there was, um, there's the jazz course, and then there's the pop course, and then that was the songwriting course, okay, which was like so fucking garbage. So it'd be like you'd have a whole class, and then I mean I, the chute is a super nice guy. I don't want to, I'm not gonna, I shouldn't rip people out, he's never gonna hear this.
Speaker 3:He's a super nice guy, but he's just seemed real out of it, right, um, and was like we'd have a whole class. So if you end a line with moon, you can, you know, have a word that rhymes with moon. The end of the next line, what are some words that rhyme with moon? Sure, I don't know. It was like oh, this isn't, this isn't how I write songs.
Speaker 2:So I wanted to see, though did that inform your songwriting? It seems like it, like were you already underway of like in the processes of writing your own songs when you attended, when you started attending that that pop yeah, section of definitely.
Speaker 3:I was like, honestly, with that part of it, I don't know. I just thought you can't really teach a lot of that stuff. You have to just like find your own taste. Yeah, and I think the best way to learn is always by like just diving deep into music and being a music fan and listening to lots of music and just figuring out why you like the things you like and then almost just trying to replicate that for a bit until you figure out how to just, you know, really do it for yourself. And there's like, there's ways people can maybe help you and guide you, but I don't know, you really just have to find your own taste and just like understand why you like the music you like. I think that's just, I don't know. Just being a music fan is always, I think, so much more important than like a formal education, right?
Speaker 2:right, you know, and did you have an idea of the aesthetic that you wanted to create with Pickle Darling Like, was it, or did you? Stumble upon it or did you like kind of create a persona or how you wanted the songs to I think I noticed I I always liked, um, I don't know how to describe it.
Speaker 3:I always liked music that I thought was like pretty. That was always a thing. When I was young I was like never, I don't know, I was never into, like you know, a lot of the cool. I was never into, like you know, a lot of the cool bands. I was never into like Sonic Youth or anything you know I was, I like, always preferred, like I don't know, I love all that like early 2000s, like soft rock, like you know, like Travis and Coldplay and stuff you know, just like, yeah, very melodic and um, well, I was super into the beatles growing up and like sparkle horse and syphian stevens and joanna newsom and that sort of like. Oh, it's all about like intricate melodies and lots of like, lots of details. It's just kind of like ear candy.
Speaker 3:That was always what, what I was into and I was never that into like electric guitars or or noise or I don't know um, so I think that was always something that, um, I was always I don't know, always kind of informed. My music and I think in terms of like my sound, that kind of just came out of like limitations. I was always a big fan of like okay, like uh, just kind of making use of what I have and seeing how good I can make that, as opposed to just trying to buy more expensive gear or waiting to like have access to a studio. And it's also, when you have access to a studio or something, it's like you're not in full control of it.
Speaker 3:You can't really it's hard to make your own it's hard to make everything sound like you're not in full control of it. You can't really. It's hard to make your own. It's hard to make everything sound like you. Um, so that was always, I don't know. So I I still just use one mic and I just use logic pro to record everything. Um, and you've always had a home studio, I imagine, like is that where you?
Speaker 3:record most of your your songs at home or the demos yeah, at home, and then you bring them to the studio no, I've, I never use a studio, I think I think for me a studio would be such a struggle because it's so much about, like, the specific details that when I'm recording, I know instantly if I've made a mistake or have to redo something and I just I can just quickly hit the space bar, press enter, start again. I don't have to like communicate to someone else, or if I have an idea, I can just record instantly, um, and you know, sit in my room for, like you know, seven hours and not feel like I'm wasting someone's time. Yeah, interesting.
Speaker 1:And did?
Speaker 2:you did your records like between like. Again, I was, I was, I was, you know, just reading up on some of the reviews and stuff that had been put out there and it was saying that, cosmonaut, your, your record, that, uh, that you put out in 2021 was much more. You wanted that more meticulous, and then it shifted with this latest record to being much more. I think you said a quote from you was let's have more beautiful nothing happening within. And you were wanting it to be more authentic and less, you know, knob turning.
Speaker 1:Is that a?
Speaker 2:difference that you looked at when you were, when you record the difference between those two records that you put out.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I think with with Cosmonaut, I was really thinking a lot about albums that feel like albums, you know, like I don't know, like the like Yankee Hotel, foxtrot, or like a Microphones album, where it's like it's not necessarily about the individual songs but, you know, there's more space for like long I don't know long kind of passages that go somewhere, or, yeah, I don't know, that album still feels like a really cohesive kind of journey, whereas with Laundromat it was a lot about like more about my daily practice is like what music is to me, and it was about like every, every day or as much as I could, just trying to write songs for myself, not necessarily about anything, but it's just almost like a meditation for myself.
Speaker 3:Um, and I tried to keep everything on laundromat like as almost like the first instincts, if that makes sense where I wanted everything to feel as demo-y as possible, where it's like, okay, it's just chords, melody, not much else. There's no, like no crazy production, it's just like almost the bare minimum and just kind of the seed of the spark of an idea and trying to not yeah, not stamp that out. So that's why the songs are probably yeah, the songs are a lot shorter and they're, I think, more like I was thinking a lot about like writing really just really efficient kind of economic songs. So, no, no wasted time, um, yeah, no wasted notes, no wasted words, um and, yeah, did that take longer to record?
Speaker 2:um, like the one where you know the, the, the first one that you were playing around with Cosmonaut much more, and then, as you were saying, lodgemat was much more of a you know letting happen what happens. Which one did you find you related to more and has that informed perhaps your future songs and records that you're probably working on now or have like did it, did it? Change the way you process songs and how you approach writing them.
Speaker 3:I think there's always something I kind of pick up on the way, but each album I feel like is always like a reaction to the last album, Like everything I found frustrating, but the last album. So then I've just kind of finished a new album and it's almost the opposite of laundromat, where I was like tired of songs. I was like I hate the idea of writing songs. Now I just want to like actually make an album that's almost like about recording and like what I can do with recording. Um, I don't know. So there's lots of like. The songs are more kind of assembled from like lots of bits of recording and the guitar parts are all like cut up and assembled and I don't know. I really wanted to make an album that felt like it was about, I don't know, just about the act of recording and production and and just yeah.
Speaker 1:So that's. That's the next that too.
Speaker 2:I mean you. I think you took a course, or?
Speaker 3:yeah. So I did one year of audio engineering right after jazz school and I had a kind of similar approach. I'm like I wouldn't know. I still wouldn't know how to operate a shooter, but I just I went into that course just being like I want to get what I need to get to make my own music and then I'm going to drop out. That was almost always my approach from the start. Um, and that was one of the tutors he was. He was awesome because it was so refreshing to have a tutor be like okay, like I can tell you how I would do things or my personal approach to recording or or production, but it's a creative thing, so I can't actually tell you what's right or wrong. You have to like. If you like it, that's right, which is like crazy to hear a tutor tell you that you know yeah, yeah because he would.
Speaker 3:That was always his how he would critique your work. It was always like I can only tell you what my personal taste is, but I'm not going to tell you that this is the wrong way to do it, which I feel. I feel like I needed to hear you know.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, kind of putting a mirror up and saying, well, you, you tell me like, yeah, I think it. It sounds like it pushes that reflection even further of yourself and, through that process, like what were the greatest tips and tricks or lessons that you brought out from and brought into your music that were really valuable to you. Once you know you had left, you know you'd finished the course, you.
Speaker 3:Once you know you had left, you know you'd finish the course. I think it's a lot about like for me in terms of practical things, about production. I think so much of like um the. The problems that you face in production and mixing are actually songwriting and arrangement. Songwriting and arrangement issues, if that makes sense. So, like, often, what happens, um, is that like I don't know you, maybe people go into studio and record a whole bunch of stuff and it's like oh, how do I get this sounding good? A lot of it's just a songwriting issue where it's like you have to, because, because I record and produce my own stuff, whenever I'm writing or arranging a song, I'm writing it with the production in mind, like I'm writing parts being like this is going to be in the right speaker, this is going to be like it's really low in the left, so I don't have things kind of just like filling up the same space or tripping over themselves, like every part is kind of made with the final recording in mind.
Speaker 2:If it makes sense, yeah yeah.
Speaker 3:So I don't know, just cutting lots of stuff out and making space while you're arranging a song, like I feel like was something I it seems tricky, though, to like.
Speaker 2:Nobody's ever explained it like that, like because I often ask like for for diy artists. Like you have two hats you're wearing right, you have your artist hat, and then you have the whole production hat that you're wearing as well and how do you fuse those? But nobody's ever talked about how they do them simultaneously, like you were describing, which I find really fascinating.
Speaker 3:Yeah, and I think if you have an okay ear and you know what you like, you don't really need fancy gear at all. Okay ear and you know what you like, you don't really need fancy gear at all. You can. There are great sounding albums made with fancy, fancy gear, but also great sounding albums that are made without fancy gear, because they know their gear and they know how to use it and how to make something I don't know, like if it's a shitty microphone like they, they know how that, how it sounds, what it like, how it records well, like how to mix it in a way that fits you know. That makes a cohesive piece of kind of sound world.
Speaker 2:I guess that's interesting, like kind of getting to know your gear and what it does and then what you need to do to get the sound out of it that you're looking for yeah, or if you have like, if you don't have fancy gear, like you can still make something that sounds energetic.
Speaker 3:It's like oh, that's often the best way to like approach it. Like like the guided by voices albums sound amazing and they, because they sound so like, they sound like someone's just found them at the bottom of I don't know like buried underground and it's just like exploding with energy Totally.
Speaker 2:You know, yeah. Yeah and Lucas, what? What were the tipping points in your musical journey so far, like, what were some moments in time where you felt like you, you, you went up the next step or went to the next level with your music? What were some of those events or occurrences that kind of excited you and said, okay, I'm not flatlining, I see the steps. I see how it's progressing.
Speaker 3:I think I guess an early one would be. I think, hmm, I guess an early one would be when the the bets took me on tour Cause that was kind of my first tour, my first real tour Um, and I was the uh the opening band for their like South Island shows we took. So we did four shows with them and the second show we'd ever really played as a band together was in a huge theater with 800 people. I was so nervous.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I can imagine it was very scary, but I don't know. I think because when I first started Pukoran, I never had the intention of playing live it. I just, it just became a thing because people keep asking me like, oh, you should play a show, you should open for us, and so I guess I should assemble a band. Um, yeah, and eventually, how did the best find you?
Speaker 3:like how was it through their z tapes at the time, or was it me, I'm not, I'm not sure, but I think because New Zealand is so small, like if you're making music and you're I don't know making a better name for yourself, the best eventually find you. I think also because they're such a um, they're such music fans and there's such a proactive band and helping out other, like they're such a champion of New Zealand bands and they will always reach out and encourage you and like I don't know, they're really cool, they really help people out in like really practical ways as well, like they're always yeah. So there's that and there's also I mean, I guess the biggest one is probably signing to father daughter records, which was like great, great label. I don't know that's, that's, that's kind of I don't know, it's kind of crazy.
Speaker 2:It's always kind of like in the back of mind a bit of a dream to sign to like an international label. Um, and was that relationship right from the get-go a positive? One for you and like is that a kind of label that respects your um artistic freedom and like they don't put too many parameters in your way.
Speaker 3:Yeah, no, they put like no parameters in a way and, um, yeah, I feel like, because they're it's, it's, you know, it's basically two people and I was like, oh, they're just very hard working and they're just like nice people and we've just become friends, you know. So now, like I, I want to do well for them, if that makes sense, because I can see how hard that worked for me and I'm like, I'm like I feel bad that I'm costing them so much money. I'm like, okay, I want to try and make this money for you. You know well, I'm sure in turn.
Speaker 2:You definitely help. You know their label out as well um, we'll see is is um laundromat that you're first on um yeah okay, unfollowed which is it's weird, because that was the album that I made with like no audience.
Speaker 3:That was like laundromat I made is like this is my giving up album, this is my album that I'm like okay, I don't care about climbing the music career ladder, I just need to figure out what music is to me and like why I make music just for myself and and the aim I guess I was just gonna like kind of I don't know, just dump it on the internet or something or make my own records, or I was, I was, I'm always going to make records for my whole life, whether there's a label involved or not, you know, um, but it's happy, I mean it's.
Speaker 2:It's nice to have the support, though, um yeah, so I I pretty much finished the album when they reached out to me and yeah, good for you, man, good for you, and I just I'm curious about that first series of shows that you did, like what was your setup? Because I mean diy artists, I mean you do everything right, and then to translate that to a group of people sitting and standing in front of you, it's quite sometimes it can be quite challenging what, how did, how did you translate the record stuff to a live performance?
Speaker 3:it's, it's hard but it's, it's very fun. But, um, just a lot of problem solving and a lot of like because there's no set default sounds we can fall back on, because it's not like a rock band with his bass, electric guitar, drums. It's like, okay, the first iteration of the live band there were five people, no drums. It was like drum machine me on acoustic guitar, someone else also on acoustic guitar, oh, there was someone on bass and someone on like glockenspiel, and and yeah, and and yeah. And then the second version it was like yeah, well, so it's basically when there's, when there's a full band, it's just drum machine, keyboards, guitar, yeah, it's just like no bass, no bass for electric guitars. So sound people other than the fact that I sing really quietly, sound guys that it shows love us. Because there's no drums and amps on stage. Everything is the eye control easily what's going on, yeah, yeah, that's cool yeah and did.
Speaker 2:Did playing live inform your music or or change it a little bit? Like, did you start thinking about if I was playing this live? You know, like before you were saying, when I, when I'm first creating a song, I think of the two, like the production side and what I'm writing and the artistic side did. Did the live stuff, playing live start to seep in there as well as you were as?
Speaker 3:you continue to write songs, Not not really, to be honest, because I felt when I play live it's not I don't know. For a long time I always felt like a compromise, if that makes sense, whereas I think when I started I never felt like a real musician for a long time because I hadn't grown up playing gigs and I didn't feel like I could get up on stage with a guitar and a mic and just put on a show by myself. So I think over the last couple of years that was something that I really worked on. I was like, okay, I want to, and I did. I actually did like a couple of open mic nights and that was just like harrowing Um, whereas, okay, I want to see if I can just like get on stage with just an acoustic guitar and a mic and my songs and like put on a show.
Speaker 3:How did you feel those experiences went? Yeah, I think the open mic night went pretty terrible, but because right after me there was this. Right after me and right before me there were these like hard out, like fusion jazz rock bands that were all like super musiciany, um, it was crazy night, um. And there's like these like child prodigies, it's like. I think right after me it was like it looked like they're all like 12 and they're all just like shredding. I was like oh god what am I?
Speaker 3:it was really insane.
Speaker 3:Like you couldn't have made me look worse but it didn't deter you like no, so I I've since then yeah then, when I was opening for people and also because it's so expensive to take a band, you know where, right, when you're like playing opening slots and stuff, I've taken a bit. We, when we open for like um, we open for lucidacus and open for what's for open for, are you open for matchbox 20? I was like, okay, I'll take a band for those. I played an arena with matchbox 20, no check, and it was insane but I don't know.
Speaker 3:Anyway, with with playing solo, I think that's where I've kind of found my my thing as a live performer, because I was like, oh man, I actually really love playing guitar and I love, I like kind of grew to love singing and and just actually like feeling the audience listening. I love also like just listening to the audience as well and trying to I don't know, I just love the kind of like almost challenge of just trying to engage an audience and having that conversation with them and um, bringing I don't know making everyone be quiet and listen really closely. Yeah, I kind of grew to love that and I love.
Speaker 3:I love those sorts of shows, like really quiet shows, um, so, yeah, because I'm on this tour, fitting so nicely with with that kind of environment um and yeah, and it kind of makes me feel more like a songwriter yeah, I was like oh yeah, actually like, and then I feel like that's actually what's informed my music. Now it's like um is because now I'm working on it, I've been writing a whole bunch of songs over the last few months that I'm like oh, these are songs that I'm just writing for voice and guitar, um, and yeah, I don't know. I just I love, yeah, just presenting the song itself.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and are you finding that you're? You're feeling more confident with your delivery and where you're putting your vocals in the songs.
Speaker 3:I think so. Do you mean in terms of recording or playing live?
Speaker 2:In live performances, Because you were saying that when you first started you were very quiet in how you delivered. Has that changed a little bit?
Speaker 3:in in how you delivered. Has that changed a little bit, the more I think I still sing. I sing more confidently, but I still sing very quietly. But I, because I'm playing guitar, it's like I can just bring everything down right. I don't know. I can sing quietly and I can then play quieter. Yeah, like I can be more dynamic and be quieter with intention, like Like there's some songs where I'll like whisper a bit of it and just hearing, I don't know. Just being in a room where there's like 120 people and everyone's just being really quiet Cause they, they're trying to hear it, it's like a really cool. Yeah, that's wicked, I don't know, it's just a really cool energy in the room. That I don't know.
Speaker 3:And you're kind of like the puppeteer, kind of like yeah, like you have a sense when you have them like when they're, I think so, zoned into what you're singing playing, whereas when you're playing with a full band it's hard.
Speaker 3:You, I feel like I'm thinking so much about what's going on that it's hard to really be conscious of the energy in the room. When you're playing solo, you're, I feel like you're super conscious of it, because I've played shows where I'm like I'm opening or playing an event or something and it's like everyone's just chatting the whole way and I'm like, well, okay, I'm just gonna play the songs, and you're like I, I have no one. It's, that's annoying.
Speaker 2:Yeah, um, because there is an intimacy there, right that you're trying to, yeah, and then you got a bunch of jackasses, yeah, or whatever. You know, it's just like dudes. Come on um yeah, respect so, listeners, if you're at a show, listen to the music and talk, yeah, and you'll have during you'll have a better night that's right, exactly, exactly I wanted to just ask too, uh, lucas, about like I really enjoyed the milkman of human kindness. The cover you did of billy bragg, oh yeah, um, how did you decide upon covering that song?
Speaker 3:I mean, I've always liked that song. That's one of my. The first billy bragg album is one of my all-time favorite albums, just because of just how it sounds. It's just guitar and vocals, uh, seven songs. It's so short. The album is like what? 13 minutes or something. It's so short and every song is just a banger. Yeah, I don't know. For me that's like just the perfect album. Um, like, I would love to make an album that's just like seven bangers, um, and then like so many people would cover too.
Speaker 2:I mean, you know like, yeah, you're so right in saying that and I think every one of those has been covered, like 20 yeah, you know many, many times um and I saw him live.
Speaker 3:That's when I got that.
Speaker 2:That tea towel yeah that it's not a poster, it's actually a tea towel. Okay, um, talking to the tax man about poetry, right?
Speaker 3:yeah, yeah, um, I saw him live. I think it might have been last year and he performed for two hours just himself on a guitar and that I thought that was so I don't know. That was so inspiring. I was like, oh, you can't do it, you can, you can sell out a whole theater.
Speaker 2:You know like 1500 people on stage like he's such a show, yeah, like you can tell that he's been doing this since he was a teenager. Um, yeah, once he has the crowd and they come to, you know, they listen, you know, because he has like all this history and records that he just seems like he's in your living room, you know, let's gather around the campfire. You know just saying, and I'll tell you some stories and we'll talk about politics a bit and stuff like that yeah it's like so you're just glued to him the whole time um and it's hard to do right.
Speaker 2:I mean, I think his experience and consistency um reveals that quite a lot yeah.
Speaker 3:So I think I, when I like think about the future for me, I'm like, okay, what is like myself at my my peak? I don't know what would my live show look like. And I'm, oh yeah, we'd probably look. I'm like what's, what's? What would a quiet version of billy brag be in a theater? You know like, yeah, I don't know.
Speaker 2:I think it would be. This is cool, pickle, darling. It would, it would be. It would be. Well, lucas, this has been a really fine treat. Thanks so much for accepting this invite.
Speaker 3:Oh, no, thanks for chatting. I listen to those podcasts.
Speaker 2:Yeah, Cool. Well, I mean, it's been a pleasure Give us a little idea like what's coming down the pipe that you can talk about and that we could look forward to.
Speaker 3:Um from pickle darling um, so I have, I have an album that's probably going to come out next year. Uh, it's just being mixed at the moment. Um, and then. And then what else I'm doing? The soundtrack for a game called show fly, which is being developed at the moment. Wow, um, and yeah, I'm just writing lots of songs and I don't really have big goals. I don't know, I just want to make write lots of songs, record lots of songs. Awesome, that's a fine goal for me.
Speaker 2:I'll tell you I'm I'm excited that you have something in the works for 2025. Um, I think that you should come back on and we can talk about it and compare it to the other ones and how the evolution has happened. And if, if you were to give us a little sneak peek of what's coming in 2025, what would you close? What would you most closely relate it to of what you've done already?
Speaker 3:I think it's because each album is like a reaction against the last one. It's more, the songs are longer, they're more kind of chopped up and maybe a bit less songy. So it feels closer to cosmonaut, I think maybe, but yeah, I don't know. It's just more, I don't know. For me it's quite experimental, but for everyone else it's probably not. It's probably not very experimental, but for me it just feels like a change. I really kind of challenged myself and I spent months and months on every song, like there's nothing that I don't know. It was kind of a struggle to make, to be honest, but because I just kind of set myself, uh, myself, these kind of challenges, so like, yeah, almost, if I yeah, keep up the good work and I mean keep writing.
Speaker 2:Um, we love your stuff and I'm speaking for more than than just me. I have tons of friends that I've introduced you to them, and they become avid listeners.
Speaker 3:Oh, amazing Thank you.
Speaker 2:You're doing something really special, and I love the aesthetic of it, I love the sound of it, I love your style. So it seems to all be clicking here, lucas. So please carry on, and we, as listeners, will follow along on the journey.
Speaker 3:Thanks so much and you keep doing, you keep doing your thing. It's a great podcast.
Speaker 2:Thanks, man I appreciate it.
Speaker 3:You're a great interviewer.
Speaker 2:Well, thanks a lot, I appreciate it, and you have yourself a good day. I guess you're off to work soon. Yeah, yeah, cool, well, enjoy, and we'll talk soon.
Speaker 3:Awesome Cheers. Have a good day. I recollect dreams about the world fitting in my hand.
Speaker 1:History buried to my terrarium scale when I met with the servant. Part of the great experience. Oh, can you Please give me the okay To leave and get by To get lunch early. I need a bite. Oh, can you. I need a bike. A parking lot. Let me try to swipe your card, pick a third to see if somebody did it. Third, third, push daisy.
Speaker 1:Enter the middle of the field On my way to the strange beaches. In the park there are some things I whisper to the leaves in the grass. When they whisper back, I begin to see double. When I get hurt, I send intrusive thoughts to the stars. Well, I'm not as pretty as I like. No, I'm not really as I like. No, I'm not as pretty as I like. No, I'm not really as I like. Before I go, now, promise me you'll pick me up a souvenir Now and, darling, I wanna catch. The progress of the human race. Now, disclosure, my fists are made of feathers and they tip it off. The human race Now Disclosure, my fists are made of feathers and they tip it out To. I've broken Every promise Lend to me with my bare hands. Well, I'm not Pretty as I like. Well, I'm not pretty as I like. Well, I'm not pretty as I like. No, I'm not pretty as I like. No, I'm not pretty as I like. Guitar solo. Thank you.
